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March of the Beekeepers
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biffvernon



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 18552
Location: Lincolnshire

PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:23 pm    Post subject: March of the Beekeepers Reply with quote

http://www.ejfoundation.org/bees/march_of_the_beekeepers

Quote:
The March of the Beekeepers

10.30am for 11am start. Ends 12.30 / Friday 26th April 2013

Parliament Square, Westminster, London

Who: Avaaz, Buglife, Environmental Justice Foundation, Friends of the Earth, Greenpeace, Pesticide Action Network UK, RSPB, Soil Association and 38 Degrees.

What: Beekeepers with smokers (not lit), flanked by supporting celebrities, people wearing beehive hair, carrying flowers, apples, pears and other pollinated vegetables, honey and jam, a giant Winnie the Pooh.

Why: To grab the weekend headlines and pile the pressure on the Rt Hon Owen Paterson MP, Secretary of State for Environment and Rural Affairs, ahead of a vital EU vote banning neonicotinoid pesticides on Monday 29th April. Even the House of Commons Environmental Audit Committee has concluded certain neonicotinoids are harmful to bees and The March of the Beekeepers will show Mr Paterson the full weight of public, expert and Government opinion and persuade him to now support a European ban.

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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 8583
Location: south east England

PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is truly extra-ordinary that it is taking this much effort to get the message through to the FUCKWITS that are running this country. This 2013, not 1965. We know these pesticides are killing bees and other invertebrates that are essential to the proper functioning of the ecosystem, not to mention the ECONOMY OF THE UK. We still have farms, right? Rolling Eyes

Owen Paterson is currently heading for a special place in the history of ECOLOGICAL FUCKWITTERY.
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 5637
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are neonicotinoids the same as nicotine?
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 5637
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UndercoverElephant wrote:
It is truly extra-ordinary that it is taking this much effort to get the message through to the FUCKWITS that are running this country. This 2013, not 1965. We know these pesticides are killing bees and other invertebrates that are essential to the proper functioning of the ecosystem, not to mention the ECONOMY OF THE UK. We still have farms, right? Rolling Eyes

Owen Paterson is currently heading for a special place in the history of ECOLOGICAL FUCKWITTERY.
Given the blatantly obvious danger these pesticides pose to pollinators one can only suspect the powerful hidden lobbying hand of big-pharma behind the UK government's current intransigence.
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biffvernon



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 18552
Location: Lincolnshire

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevecook172001 wrote:
Are neonicotinoids the same as nicotine?


No. But there is a chemical reason why the two words share a number of letters.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neonicotinoid
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
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Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

biffvernon wrote:
stevecook172001 wrote:
Are neonicotinoids the same as nicotine?


No. But there is a chemical reason why the two words share a number of letters.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neonicotinoid
Well, now, you may be surprised to learn I'd already reasonably surmised they might be related B. My question was whether they are the same. Whilst you have answered that question with the first part of your post (though a little more expansion on "no" would have been welcome) the second part of your post is, as usual, unnecessarily patronising.

That's a fairly hefty ego you're lugging around with you there B. Either that, or you really do need to work on your communication skills.
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biffvernon



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 18552
Location: Lincolnshire

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bloody Hell Steve, calm down.

There were three bits to my response.
1. the 'No', was just a neat statement of fact, answering your question.
2. I then qualified that by pointing out that there was a reason why the two words had a similarity.
3. I then posted a link that explained what that similarity was and how it arose.
I was trying to be helpful, giving you a short answer to your sensible question and pointing you in the direction of a longer answer should you want it. What more could you have wanted?
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
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Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

biffvernon wrote:
Bloody Hell Steve, calm down.

There were three bits to my response.
1. the 'No', was just a neat statement of fact, answering your question.
2. I then qualified that by pointing out that there was a reason why the two words had a similarity.
3. I then posted a link that explained what that similarity was and how it arose.
I was trying to be helpful, giving you a short answer to your sensible question and pointing you in the direction of a longer answer should you want it. What more could you have wanted?
Fair enough B. My mistake was in assuming that it would be blindingly obvious to you I was not so unutterably thick as to not already realize that "neonocotinoid", being linguistically very similar to "nicotine", would be obviously related and that my question was, therefore, about whether or not they were essentially synonymous terms.
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RenewableCandy



Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 12441
Location: York

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which begs the question:

Bee forages on tobacco-plant flowers. What happens next? Does the bee snuff it (or get lost, or whatever)? And if so, is this a rather serious evolutionary drawback for said tobacco plant?
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RenewableCandy wrote:
Which begs the question:

Bee forages on tobacco-plant flowers. What happens next? Does the bee snuff it (or get lost, or whatever)? And if so, is this a rather serious evolutionary drawback for said tobacco plant?
That's exactly what I was wondering about. If true, then one might surmise that the flowers do not contain nicotine. Either that, or nicotine, though a related substance, is not the same as nicotinoids. Nevertheless, I am sure you will have heard of using nicotine from a packet of rolling tobacco as a very effective insecticide, so I'm not sure at all.
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RenewableCandy



Joined: 12 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, I do believe my grandfather (a keen gardener) used to do just that.

I mean, I'm assuming baccy plants aren't wind-pollinated?
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UndercoverElephant



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RenewableCandy wrote:
Yes, I do believe my grandfather (a keen gardener) used to do just that.

I mean, I'm assuming baccy plants aren't wind-pollinated?


Insect pollinated. That's why they smell so nice (the flowers). Moths probably, because they smell at night.
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UndercoverElephant



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My guess was right - normal pollinators are moths:

http://phenomena.nationalgeographic.com/2010/01/21/tobacco-plants-foil-very-hungry-caterpillars-by-switching-pollinators-to-hummingbirds/
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biffvernon



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
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Location: Lincolnshire

PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


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RenewableCandy



Joined: 12 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But...if Nicotine's an insecticide, doesn't it kill (or at least damage) the moths?
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