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Carbon Offset....sort of
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RenewableCandy



Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 12654
Location: York

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

clv101 wrote:
RenewableCandy wrote:
What I don't really get about offsets is, why should they involve the 1/3world at all? As emordnilap says, per person the 1/3world does naff-all to contribute to the problem:

Because today it's cheaper and quicker to save CO2 in the 1/3 world than here...

Fair enough, but I would counter that in the 1/3world it is far harder to prove (a) that your scheme is happening, and (b) that if it is happening, it would not have happened anyway. I also wonder, who owns all this marvellous kit once it's up and running, and who profits from it? Because given the precedent of, what has happened with a lot of perfectly well-intentioned 1/3world aid over the years, the omens are not good...
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emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 14536
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fair and valid points RC and why I bang on about taking responsibility for our own pollution. The poor old third world yet again has to do our shitty jobs. Not content with already paying crap wages for crap jobs in crap conditions, outsourcing our pollution too, do-gooders now give them peanuts in the belief that they can carry on polluting as normal.

You jet off shopping in New York and hand over 20 to a company that may or may not plant trees sometime in the future, in some place that you might or might not ever see. If the trees are planted, you've achieved your aim. What happens when those become more valuable? Or they're in the way?

Fecking Kyoto. What a waste of time. 'Clean development mechanism' my arse.

Besides, my natural cynicism says that carbon offset schemes have one aim - money for shareholders/owners of said schemes.
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clv101
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 8097

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

emordnilap wrote:
The poor old third world yet again has to do our shitty jobs. Not content with already paying crap wages for crap jobs in crap conditions, outsourcing our pollution too, do-gooders now give them peanuts in the belief that they can carry on polluting as normal.
\

This isn't right at all. There are no 'shitty jobs' being passed to others. No pollution outsourced, in fact the exact opposite, we keep using the dirty infrastructure and they get the new clean tech.

Watch this video:
http://www.theconvergingworld.org/movie/movie

And read this:
http://www.theconvergingworld.org/first_step
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biffvernon



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 18541
Location: Lincolnshire

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about the dirty plastic food container that we throw in the recycling bin and that gets washed out by an Indian before the plastic can actually be reused?
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clv101
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Joined: 24 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

biffvernon wrote:
What about the dirty plastic food container that we throw in the recycling bin and that gets washed out by an Indian before the plastic can actually be reused?

It's nothing to do with carbon offsetting?
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biffvernon



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fair 'nuff.
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emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 14536
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

clv101 wrote:
emordnilap wrote:
The poor old third world yet again has to do our shitty jobs. Not content with already paying crap wages for crap jobs in crap conditions, outsourcing our pollution too, do-gooders now give them peanuts in the belief that they can carry on polluting as normal.
\

This isn't right at all. There are no 'shitty jobs' being passed to others. No pollution outsourced, in fact the exact opposite, we keep using the dirty infrastructure and they get the new clean tech.

Watch this video:
http://www.theconvergingworld.org/movie/movie

And read this:
http://www.theconvergingworld.org/first_step


Optimist. Maybe Naomi Klein should consult you for the update to No Logo. Wink
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