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vtsnowedin



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 4604
Location: New England ,Chelsea Vermont

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So the people that died that day were killed by bullets and flack from mortars and not from gas? Why did the responders hose them down with water if they were full of shrapnel?
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Little John



Joined: 08 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

are you are actually being serious?
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raspberry-blower



Joined: 14 Mar 2009
Posts: 1559

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

vtsnowedin wrote:
So the people that died that day were killed by bullets and flack from mortars and not from gas? Why did the responders hose them down with water if they were full of shrapnel?


Jonathan Cook wrote:
That doctor says the video was real, but did not show the effects of a chemical weapons attack. It showed something else. This is what the doctor is reported saying:


I was with my family in the basement of my home three hundred metres from here on the night but all the doctors know what happened. There was a lot of shelling [by government forces] and aircraft were always over Douma at night — but on this night, there was wind and huge dust clouds began to come into the basements and cellars where people lived. People began to arrive here suffering from hypoxia, oxygen loss. Then someone at the door, a ‘White Helmet’, shouted ‘Gas!”, and a panic began. People started throwing water over each other. Yes, the video was filmed here, it is genuine, but what you see are people suffering from hypoxia – not gas poisoning.


There is your answer right there, VT.

There is also this:

Jonathan Cook wrote:
UPDATE:

Fisk’s account is corroborated by another reporter there, Pearson Sharp of the conservative news network One America. Unlike Fisk, who I know has a long track record as a highly credible reporter of events in the Middle East, Sharp is an unknown quantity to me. But it may be significant that he echoes Fisk in saying that no one he spoke to, even in the neighbourhood where the attack supposedly occurred, seemed aware that chemical weapons had been used.


If the locals are unaware that a chemical attack took place then NO SUCH ATTACK TOOK PLACE.

Jonathan Cook: Fisk rips away excuse for Syrian airstrike
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emordnilap



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
Posts: 14026
Location: Houǝsʇlʎ' ᴉʇ,s ɹǝɐllʎ uoʇ ʍoɹʇɥ ʇɥǝ ǝɟɟoɹʇ' pou,ʇ ǝʌǝu qoʇɥǝɹ˙

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raspberry-blower wrote:
Jonathan Cook: Fisk rips away excuse for Syrian airstrike


From that article:

Quote:
All of us have a moral responsibility to stop simply believing what our governments and their propagandists in the corporate media tell us


…which is what 96% of us on here already do. We also need to repeat the words to everyone we meet.
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careful_eugene



Joined: 26 Jun 2006
Posts: 458
Location: Nottingham UK

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raspberry-blower wrote:
vtsnowedin wrote:
So the people that died that day were killed by bullets and flack from mortars and not from gas? Why did the responders hose them down with water if they were full of shrapnel?


Jonathan Cook wrote:
That doctor says the video was real, but did not show the effects of a chemical weapons attack. It showed something else. This is what the doctor is reported saying:


I was with my family in the basement of my home three hundred metres from here on the night but all the doctors know what happened. There was a lot of shelling [by government forces] and aircraft were always over Douma at night — but on this night, there was wind and huge dust clouds began to come into the basements and cellars where people lived. People began to arrive here suffering from hypoxia, oxygen loss. Then someone at the door, a ‘White Helmet’, shouted ‘Gas!”, and a panic began. People started throwing water over each other. Yes, the video was filmed here, it is genuine, but what you see are people suffering from hypoxia – not gas poisoning.


There is your answer right there, VT.

There is also this:

Jonathan Cook wrote:
UPDATE:

Fisk’s account is corroborated by another reporter there, Pearson Sharp of the conservative news network One America. Unlike Fisk, who I know has a long track record as a highly credible reporter of events in the Middle East, Sharp is an unknown quantity to me. But it may be significant that he echoes Fisk in saying that no one he spoke to, even in the neighbourhood where the attack supposedly occurred, seemed aware that chemical weapons had been used.


If the locals are unaware that a chemical attack took place then NO SUCH ATTACK TOOK PLACE.

Jonathan Cook: Fisk rips away excuse for Syrian airstrike

The site is being visited by inspectors today (11 days after the alleged gas attack). It will be interesting to hear what they find.
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Mr. Fox



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 616
Location: In the Dark - looking for my socks

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raspberry-blower wrote:

Jonathan Cook wrote:
UPDATE:

Fisk’s account is corroborated by another reporter there, Pearson Sharp of the conservative news network One America. ..



That Pearson Sharp report:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSXwG-901yU
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Automaton



Joined: 22 Jan 2016
Posts: 141

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

careful_eugene wrote:
The site is being visited by inspectors today (11 days after the alleged gas attack). It will be interesting to hear what they find.


They were invited 3 days after the attack.... and had they started their investigations on Monday (as planned) it would still have been 9 days after, so what's 2 extra days? They should have been there last Tuesday. The Syrians and Russians are not the reason for that delay.

But it no longer matters. The US has already begun to cast doubt on the OPCW's findings, as was to be expected, saying 'Russia may have tampered with the site'. If the OPCW finds no evidence they'll just keep repeating (and strengthening) that statement. And by the time the OPCW make their report, this event will just be more fake history anyway.
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Mr. Fox



Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 616
Location: In the Dark - looking for my socks

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tomorrow, now, apparently. Ahhh... here we go:

Quote:
US Ambassador Kenneth Ward said at an OPCW meeting at The Hague on Monday that there were fears Russian forces had tampered with the site during the delay, Reuters news agency reported.

"It is our understanding the Russians may have visited the attack site," Mr Ward said. "It is our concern that they may have tampered with it with the intent of thwarting the efforts of the OPCW Fact-Finding Mission to conduct an effective investigation."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-43792120

-

Anyway... just before his (fairly successful) derail of the thread toward the staged Douma chemical attack, John said:

johnhemming2 (on Sunday) wrote:
I think we are getting more reliable evidence in respect of Salisbury


What 'evidence', John? Is it the same as your mythical 'facts' that somehow never managed to materialise?

Or are you simply referring to the Spiez Lab report?

Quote:
14.04.2018
[Russian] Embassy Press Officer comments on the findings of the Swiss experts regarding the Salisbury incident

Q. Is there any new information regarding the findings of experts from Switzerland in connection with the Salisbury poisoning?

A. According to information from the Swiss Federal Institute for NBC-protection in Spiez, its experts received samples collected in Salisbury by the OPCW specialists and finished testing them on 27 March.

The experts of the Institute discovered traces of toxic chemical called “BZ” and its precursors. It is a Schedule 2 substance under the Chemical Weapons Convention.

“BZ” is a chemical agent, which is used to temporary incapacitate people. The desired psychotoxic effect is reached in 30-60 minutes after application of the agent and lasts up to four days. According to the information the Russian Federation possesses, this agent was used in the armed forces of the USA, United Kingdom and several others NATO member states. No stocks of such substance ever existed either in the Soviet Union or in the Russian Federation.

In addition, the Swiss specialists discovered strong concentration of traces of the nerve agent of A-234 type in its initial states as well as its decomposition products.

In view of the experts, such concentration of the A-234 agent would result in inevitable fatal outcome of its administration. Moreover, considering its high volatility, the detection of this substance in its initial state (pure form and high concentration) is extremely suspicious as the samples have been taken several weeks since the poisoning.

It looks highly likely that the “BZ” nerve agent was used in Salisbury. The fact that Yulia Skripal and Detective Sergeant Nick Bailey have already been discharged from hospital, and Sergei Skripal is on his way to recovery, only supports such conclusion.

All this information was not mentioned in the final OPCW report at all.

Considering the above, we have numerous serious questions to all interested parties, including the OPCW.
https://www.rusemb.org.uk/fnapr/6486

I'm sure the UKG are more than happy to let this whole 'Salisbury Incident' thing slip off down the memory hole, concentrating instead on whatever hysterical anti-Russian propaganda they can dream up to push it further out of the news cycle...

Today's crop includes such highlights as more 'Russian Hacking' scare stories, where Assad's children went on holiday and concern for the welfare of a f***ing bear.

The monsters! Rolling Eyes
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kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 10251
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Council for the defence said their client didn't do it!! Well he would wouldn't he.
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stumuz1



Joined: 07 Jun 2016
Posts: 39
Location: Anglesey

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Latest in long line of Russian Journalists carelessly slipping off their balconies after investigating non existing Russian mercenaries belonging to a denied private security firm associated with Russian Government.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-43781351

But don't worry kids, Russian Police said there are no suspicious circumstances.
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kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 10251
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stumuz1 wrote:
....But don't worry kids, Russian Police said there are no suspicious circumstances.


Russian police are correct. There's nothing suspicious about it. Suspicion implies a level of doubt!
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johnhemming2



Joined: 30 Jun 2015
Posts: 2133

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually there can be a suspect without doubt.
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woodburner



Joined: 06 Apr 2009
Posts: 3637

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stumuz1 wrote:
Latest in long line of Russian Journalists carelessly slipping off their balconies after investigating non existing Russian mercenaries belonging to a denied private security firm associated with Russian Government.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-43781351

But don't worry kids, Russian Police said there are no suspicious circumstances.



Quote:
Journalisnm is a dangerous business in Russia


Just remember David Kelly. Being an expert who has knowledge which conflicts with the fabricated story the government wants to publish, is a dangerous business, and that’s in the corruption-free United Kingdom.
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johnhemming2



Joined: 30 Jun 2015
Posts: 2133

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

woodburner wrote:
Just remember David Kelly. Being an expert who has knowledge which conflicts with the fabricated story the government wants to publish, is a dangerous business, and that’s in the corruption-free United Kingdom.

I have fought a lot of corruption in the UK and seen corruption that was too embedded in the establishment to beat. However, I have not seen enough to persuade me that David Kelly was a victim of some state actors.
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woodburner



Joined: 06 Apr 2009
Posts: 3637

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

However it was achieved, either direct action or intolerable pressure, Campbell was a significant instrument in Kelly’s demise. His devious manipulation of the media was a prime example of dirty deeds.
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