PowerSwitch Main Page
PowerSwitch
The UK's Peak Oil Discussion Forum & Community
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

SUVs not EVs
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    PowerSwitch Forum Index -> Transport
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Potemkin Villager



Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 1050
Location: Narnia

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:52 pm    Post subject: SUVs not EVs Reply with quote

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/03/climate/suv-sales-global-climate.html?utm_source=Weekly+Carbon+Briefing&utm_campaign=0f6254fff7-Carbon_Brief_Weekly_09_03_2018&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_3ff5ea836a-0f6254fff7-303476225&ct=t(Carbon_Brief_Weekly_09_03_2018)&goal=0_3ff5ea836a-0f6254fff7-303476225

We really are well and truly fecked.

"It’s the car of the future. It’s taking off in markets all over in the world.

The electric vehicle? Hardly. It’s the S.U.V., the rugged, off-road gas-guzzler that America invented and the world increasingly loves to drive.

Spurred by rising incomes and lower gas prices, drivers in China, Australia and other countries are ditching their smaller sedans for bigger rides at a rapid pace
. "
_________________
"There's always been some bullshit product for farmers. And the people selling it are usually from out of town." David Friedberg
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 10586
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Little men need big cars to boost their fragile egos, unfortunately. My SUV is used as an SUV for off-roading and towing a 3.5 tonne GVW trailer or a stock trailer though as my ego doesn't need a boost!! Smile
_________________
As Steve Keen puts it: “Capital without energy is a statue; labour without energy is a corpse.” Economics ignores this which is why economics is broken.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Potemkin Villager



Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 1050
Location: Narnia

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would estimate that about only 5% of SUV/4WDs are driven by Folk who actually have a real need for them. I have the utmost contempt for the other pathetic 95% who are so desperate to appear rufty tufty.
_________________
"There's always been some bullshit product for farmers. And the people selling it are usually from out of town." David Friedberg
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
fuzzy



Joined: 29 Nov 2013
Posts: 793
Location: The Marches, UK

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We have flooded roads about once a year around here. My suzuki alto is good for about 1 foot deep [not tried more]. I often see 4x4s turning back, clearly with nothing urgent to visit.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
vtsnowedin



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 4866
Location: New England ,Chelsea Vermont

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fuzzy wrote:
We have flooded roads about once a year around here. My suzuki alto is good for about 1 foot deep [not tried more]. I often see 4x4s turning back, clearly with nothing urgent to visit.

It is the washed out road you can't see under the foot of muddy water that you fall into and get washed down stream in. What's on the other side worth risking your life for?
Women especially women with school aged children drive the SUVs and mini vans around here. They really do a good job of holding all those child seats and soccer and hockey gear. The men drive pickup trucks and could care less if people think they drive them as a status symbol. When you are stuck in the snow bank or spring mud they will churn on by and not bother to twitch you out of the ditch with the chain they keep in the back for friends and family mishaps.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Potemkin Villager



Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 1050
Location: Narnia

PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A dangerous effect on many folk driving SUVs is the belief that they are now invincible and the vehicle confers Marvel Comic style super powers that can defy all known laws of nature.

There was a very sad case locally where almost an entire family apart from a baby drowned in an Audi Q7 behemoth which slid down a slipway into the sea.

Another effect is the magnified sense of entitlement and exemption from social norms and legal requirements as displayed in road rage incidents:-

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/miami-dade/fl-reg-suv-hit-run-sledgehammer-bash-20180312-story.html
_________________
"There's always been some bullshit product for farmers. And the people selling it are usually from out of town." David Friedberg
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
vtsnowedin



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 4866
Location: New England ,Chelsea Vermont

PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Potemkin Villager wrote:
A dangerous effect on many folk driving SUVs is the belief that they are now invincible and the vehicle confers Marvel Comic style super powers that can defy all known laws of nature.

There was a very sad case locally where almost an entire family apart from a baby drowned in an Audi Q7 behemoth which slid down a slipway into the sea.

Another effect is the magnified sense of entitlement and exemption from social norms and legal requirements as displayed in riad rage incidents:-

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/miami-dade/fl-reg-suv-hit-run-sledgehammer-bash-20180312-story.html

Yes I see that a lot. People don't seem to realize that the moment you take your foot off the gas and hit the breaks you are now no better then all the other cars as they all have four wheel breaks and you with your big macho 4WD just entered the break test going 20mph faster then all the cars around you. Quite often they end up in the median, wheels pointed toward the sky showing off their "All season radials" that are really only good for all the seasons they get south of New Jersey.
Getting another Nor Easter here today, four inches so far expecting more then a foot more over the next twenty four hours. I've plowed the first bit off and will hit it again before bed time then again in the morning. Pretty mild here but down on Cape Cod they are getting horizontal snow and waves that are throwing beech rocks up onto the streets.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
woodburner



Joined: 06 Apr 2009
Posts: 3775

PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pedant watch - slowing is done with brakes, breaks is what happens when the brakes don’t work. Wink
_________________
To become an extremist, hang around with people you agree with. Cass Sunstein
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
vtsnowedin



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 4866
Location: New England ,Chelsea Vermont

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2018 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

woodburner wrote:
Pedant watch - slowing is done with brakes, breaks is what happens when the brakes don’t work. Wink

Spelling Nazi.!!
Point taken.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 10586
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2018 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vtsnowedin wrote:
.... Women especially women with school aged children drive the SUVs ...


They do in the UK too. Chelsea Tractors, they're called as they haven't even had two wheels on a grass verge let alone four wheels off road. Women buy them because they think that they're safer in a big motor but fail to realise that when everyone else has one the combined inertia in a crash between two SUVs is more likely to kill them than if they were in smaller cars!

They should be taxed off the road unless you have a farm address and a business account to go with it.
_________________
As Steve Keen puts it: “Capital without energy is a statue; labour without energy is a corpse.” Economics ignores this which is why economics is broken.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
fuzzy



Joined: 29 Nov 2013
Posts: 793
Location: The Marches, UK

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fuzzy wrote:
We have flooded roads about once a year around here. My suzuki alto is good for about 1 foot deep [not tried more]. I often see 4x4s turning back, clearly with nothing urgent to visit.


Knew I had a photo - flooded hop field in flat river plain. Lots of steep hills here and joined small river systems:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4788/40096170294_3337cb7d40_k.jpg

unfortunately the road was this side of the hedge.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
vtsnowedin



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 4866
Location: New England ,Chelsea Vermont

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenneal - lagger wrote:
vtsnowedin wrote:
.... Women especially women with school aged children drive the SUVs ...


They do in the UK too. Chelsea Tractors, they're called as they haven't even had two wheels on a grass verge let alone four wheels off road. Women buy them because they think that they're safer in a big motor but fail to realise that when everyone else has one the combined inertia in a crash between two SUVs is more likely to kill them than if they were in smaller cars!

They should be taxed off the road unless you have a farm address and a business account to go with it.

Very Happy Very Happy Yah I know a women that had an SUV for four years and never had it in four wheel drive. She assumed it always was in 4X4 and didn't know what that lever on the center mound was for.
I don't know as your big vs. big theory is valid though. The SUVs have a lot of sacrificial metal between passengers and front bumper and their safety ratings are right up there. And of course a SUV vs. Honda Civic crash goes to the SUV every time. I used to buy full sized Chevy Caprices and similar Buicks. Beaters well broken in. The six feet of front hood made quite a crumple zone. One time I heard "Daddy Daddy Mommy made the car into a pup tent". Rolling Eyes
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Potemkin Villager



Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 1050
Location: Narnia

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2018 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am taken particularly taken by how passenger protection is taken to a new level with the protection features afforded our great leaders and other associated sociopaths.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2736445/BMW-unveils-latest-bullet-proof-car-claims-manufacturer-offer-protection-AK-47-fire.html

"Security-conscious drivers can put their worries at ease after BMW unveiled its latest armoured car with claims it can withstand the fire from an AK-47.......

...... When he was Prime Minister, Tony Blair took delivery of a fully armoured BMW 7-series — dubbed the ‘Blair Panzer’ after the German word for armour.

David Cameron has, as his official car, an armoured, top-of-the-range Jaguar XJ.

But trumping them all is U.S. President Barack Obama with his gargantuan armoured Cadillac-style limousine, dubbed ‘The Beast’, which follows him around the globe on official visits.

Demand for armoured cars is on the increase in the U.S. while in Britain they are popular with Eastern European oligarchs."


_________________
"There's always been some bullshit product for farmers. And the people selling it are usually from out of town." David Friedberg
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
vtsnowedin



Joined: 07 Jan 2011
Posts: 4866
Location: New England ,Chelsea Vermont

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2018 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Potemkin Villager wrote:
I am taken particularly taken by how passenger protection is taken to a new level with the protection features afforded our great leaders and other associated sociopaths.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2736445/BMW-unveils-latest-bullet-proof-car-claims-manufacturer-offer-protection-AK-47-fire.html

"Security-conscious drivers can put their worries at ease after BMW unveiled its latest armoured car with claims it can withstand the fire from an AK-47.......

...... When he was Prime Minister, Tony Blair took delivery of a fully armoured BMW 7-series — dubbed the ‘Blair Panzer’ after the German word for armour.

David Cameron has, as his official car, an armoured, top-of-the-range Jaguar XJ.

But trumping them all is U.S. President Barack Obama with his gargantuan armoured Cadillac-style limousine, dubbed ‘The Beast’, which follows him around the globe on official visits.

Demand for armoured cars is on the increase in the U.S. while in Britain they are popular with Eastern European oligarchs."

As rifle rounds go the AK-47's ammo is on the lower end of the range 1587 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle. Determined opponents will just move up the scale to something that can penetrate the relatively light armor these cars carry. For comparison a 7mm Remington mag has 2938 ft. lbs and a 50 BMG has 14,000ft. lbs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kenneal - lagger
Site Admin


Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 10586
Location: Newbury, Berkshire

PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2018 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vtsnowedin wrote:
... For comparison a 7mm Remington mag has 2938 ft. lbs and a 50 BMG has 14,000ft. lbs.


All readily available in the US for self protection I take it.
_________________
As Steve Keen puts it: “Capital without energy is a statue; labour without energy is a corpse.” Economics ignores this which is why economics is broken.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    PowerSwitch Forum Index -> Transport All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
Page 1 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group