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Plans for world's first tidal power plant
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adam2
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am reasonably hopeful that a tidal lagoon if built will actually produce the claimed power with reasonable reliability.
If instead the money was spent on nuclear, then I am less hopeful that the power will actually be produced.
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adam2
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"tidal lagoon project thrown out"

Regrettably in my view. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-west-wales-44589083
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clv101
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a complicated situation. It is really expensive. Cutting demand or building new generating capacity with off-shore wind would be a lot cheaper low-carbon solutions. But one thing that makes us more cost sensitive than perhaps we should be is the way the subsidy is paid through our bills. This is a horribly regressive way to pay for things, and creates understandable backlash.

Personally, as a chartered engineer living nearby, I would have liked to see the project go ahead, but I can understand why it probably wasn't a good idea.
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woodburner



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Personally as a not chartered engineer living nowhere near I would like it not to go ahead and destroy yet another habitat used by species other than the incredibly selfish and thoughtless and greedy human! Exclamation
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BritDownUnder



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 1:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It would have been a nice test project into tidal power in my opinion. Better to see the money spent in the UK rather than squandered overseas (or on an Olympic bid or World Cup bid) or even on Russian or Qatari gas.
I sympathize with the people of Wales on this lost opportunity to develop low carbon electricity generation.

On the negative side it seems that the length of wall compared with the lagoon area enclosed does not make good use of natural features such as coastlines and islands and hence the (I think) 9km wall/barrier and I guess about 1km of natural coastline meant that the construction cost would have been higher.
I am aware of the differences between a tidal lagoon and a tidal barrage across an estuary and think that a project such as that proposed somewhere in Lancashire across a small estuary would have been more cost effective. Combined with flood defence such as across the Wash to protect the highly valuable agricultural land of the Fens against man made global warming induced sea level rise I think there is merit in large scale barrages before the country becomes too bankrupt to pay for them.
I do appreciate, Mr Woodburner, that a barrage is probably more damaging to non-human life, as is indeed most human 'development' but that is not a good enough excuse for me anyway to stop the development of low-carbon electricity.

I can only think that the government stood back and baulked at the cost of a 'test' project.

On an unrelated note I have been try to become a chartered engineer in Australia for a while now but it is a bit of an old boys club over here and recent changes have made this even more so. Basically you need a chartered engineer in your organisation to sponsor your development.
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adam2
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

clv101 wrote:
It's a complicated situation. It is really expensive. Cutting demand or building new generating capacity with off-shore wind would be a lot cheaper low-carbon solutions. But one thing that makes us more cost sensitive than perhaps we should be is the way the subsidy is paid through our bills. This is a horribly regressive way to pay for things, and creates understandable backlash.

Personally, as a chartered engineer living nearby, I would have liked to see the project go ahead, but I can understand why it probably wasn't a good idea.


Cutting demand might indeed be cheaper, but I see no suggestion that any of the money saved by not building the tidal lagoon is instead to be spent on demand reduction.
Wind power is getting cheaper, and in IMO, we need more of it. Not however the complete answer as the wind does not blow all the time.
Tidal power by contrast can be accurately predicted, and can also be modulated according to demand, at least to an extent.

I suspect that without this project, that our already unwise reliance on imported natural gas will increase.

Elsewhere on these forums, the inadequacy of our natural gas storage is discussed. Neither private capital nor HMG seem keen to build more storage, since in strictly cash terms it is unlikely to make a profit.
As a result we are increasingly vulnerable to any supply problems.

It could IMHO, reasonably be argued that building more renewable generating capacity SHOULD be subsidised on energy security grounds and by reducing the need for more natural gas storage.

Consider as an example, the building of another 2GW of wind turbines.
2GW would not be produced continually of course, but taking "winter" as being 2,500 hours, one might expect in the region of 1000GWH of electricity to be produced.
That would save about 2,500 GWH of natural gas.
With winter natural gas stocks at very roughly 25,000GWH, the building of an additional 2GW of renewable generating capacity, has in effect also increased gas storage by 10%

2GW of tidal power would be of even greater benefit, since the capacity factor would be better.

Power would of course be produced, and natural gas be saved all year round, but winter is of greater concern.
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